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Post by pigdish on Nov 6, 2007 10:11:34 GMT -5
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Dmitri
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Post by Dmitri on Nov 6, 2007 12:14:43 GMT -5
I don't know - based on the commercials, I thought it looked pretty darn silly... holding final judgement till I see it - probably on DVD...
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Post by pigdish on Nov 7, 2007 7:35:14 GMT -5
Oh really, what did you find silly about it? The web site is pretty cool also and the information from it gave me a feeling of the epic and classic qualities that LoTR, Narnia, and other book-movies have.
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Dmitri
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Post by Dmitri on Nov 7, 2007 12:02:35 GMT -5
Dunno, can't tie it down specifically... maybe the polar riding bears and what not... that's why I reserve final judgement till I actually see it.
I've been wrong before. But I actually didn't care much for the LOTR or Narnia films... thought they did a grave disservice to the novels. But then I tend to like epic/high fantasy books like Talkien, Lewis, LeGuin, McDonald, etc. and films more along the lines of American Beauty, Maetwan, Unfinished Life, Virgin Suicides, etc.
Though I did really like Stardust and V for Vendetta, so I can be kinda eclectic maybe. But the epic stuff tends to lose the characters I think.
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Post by pigdish on Nov 7, 2007 12:41:05 GMT -5
Oh ok. One thing most of us can agree on is that books made into movies always seem to be inferior. That's why I try to keep my focus on the movie rather than ruin the whole mood by comparing it to the books. It should be said though that if the movie doesn't hold my attention I slip into the comparison mode really fast. Also, I get roped into the hype of the trailers often. I thought Dragon Wars was going to be good but most people here said it sucked. I'm still looking forward to watching it on DVD. I haven't seen Stardust but V for Vendetta was such a great movie. Mr. Elrond Smith was amazing in that movie.
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Dmitri
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Post by Dmitri on Nov 7, 2007 15:01:24 GMT -5
Yea, I try to keept he two seperated as well, movies and books, but I mean that the characters, even in the film, are just often not well developed.
Take Theoden in LOTR. "No, I won't help. No, Gondor is on its own. Screw Gondor." Three minutes pass. "Let us ride forth to wrath and ruin!"
Huh? How did he change? Why did he change? Same goes for Elrond and his bitter portrayal in the convo with Gandalf. For about 2 minutes, he is a crotchety old elf, then all of a sudden he is being cool during the council. Same for the destruction of Faramir'c character - evil, evil. seduced by the ring... poof! Good guy! Convinced in just 3 seconds flat!
Just have a hard time with this, let alone the misrepresentation of characters like Theoden, Treebeard, et al as opposed to the book. And the axing of the scouring of the shire was my last straw.
But like I said, I'll give it a watch. The only recent fantasy film I won't see is "The Dark is Rising", and that is because I read the books, hated them and what they were saying (anti-clerical propaganda for kids - yea!), and doubt that I will like the movie anymore than the books.
Again though, that is my take - I didn't really care for 300 and I know others loved it. To each there own I guess.
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Post by Rincewind on Nov 7, 2007 15:28:16 GMT -5
But like I said, I'll give it a watch. The only recent fantasy film I won't see is "The Dark is Rising", and that is because I read the books, hated them and what they were saying (anti-clerical propaganda for kids - yea!), and doubt that I will like the movie anymore than the books. Anti-clerical propaganda? I don't remember a BIT of that from the series. I'll have to go back and re-read them sometime when I can find them, but I couldn't find any reference to that in the wikipedia either, and they're usually good at mentioning any controversy.
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Post by Tomas on Nov 7, 2007 20:14:53 GMT -5
I just finished the whole series for the first time and I didn't see any "anti-clerical" material.
Dunno.
Tom
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Post by pigdish on Nov 7, 2007 20:45:06 GMT -5
I just got the box set of the series (The Dark is Rising) so don't ruin it for me. hehe
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Dmitri
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Post by Dmitri on Nov 8, 2007 8:02:30 GMT -5
All right, let me preface this by saying, If you don't like the way I think about religion and are easily offended, please don't read on.Now that that is out of the way... I don't usually go out of my way to watch films or read books that are full of the "New Age, all Paths are Right, All "Truth" is True, Do What Makes You Feel Good" philosophy. This is essentially the way that the books, and I'm gonna guess the film, handle Christianity. "It's OK for some, but it's only one of many ways". I'd rather you say it is wrong, and move on from there, a la Arthur C Clarke and others. But I find the "I'm OK, You're OK" stuff more offensive than an outright denial. Ya got 3 choices about Jesus - Liar, Lunatic, Lord. Make one. And of course the depiction of the Rector as completely inept with no redeeming character later balance it out bugs me. So, I don't expect pro-choicers to watch "The Silent Scream", and for me it is like that - complete anathema. If I have offended anyone in this writing, well I told ya all early on not to read it! But seriously, it's just my stance - I'm sure you'll find others who don't agree, and I don't have the books handy to cite for backup.
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Post by Rincewind on Nov 8, 2007 9:52:48 GMT -5
Let's leave the heavy-handed religious debate out of this- I just wanted to know how you consider those books anti-clerical. And if you're judging it by its religious merits, I also wonder if you know the slightest thing about the director of the movie- you might want to read the below link. ozandends.blogspot.com/2006/10/questions-about-dark-is-rising-movie.htmlThe books are full of many mythological concepts which predate Christianity. Including them in no way attacks Christianity or priests. Having a clergyman rather dumbfounded about what is going on around him when he is surrounded by pagan magic seems rather natural to me. Anyway, if you want to attack the books, please cite evidence, just like we told Galadon. In any event, I think it's odd you'd give Golden Compass the benefit of the doubt and not Dark is Rising, considering that Golden Compass's author DID have a political and religious axe to grind, from what I've read.
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Dmitri
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Post by Dmitri on Nov 8, 2007 13:00:23 GMT -5
Allright, didn't expect anyone to get all fired up about that... A) I expressed my opinions of a book that I read, and didn't like. I then expressed what about that book bothered me (the New Age, quasi-religious overtones). I then outline what I'd rather see (Arthur Clarke line). I then cite my own beliefs that cause me to dislike this book (Liar Lord Lunny argument). I then cite a specific character issue, which is not only about the Old Magic aspect, but also the prayer issues I remember - as I said, I don't have the book handy to cite specifically from, and state this later. So all in all, I followed a pretty standard format for structure here. At the end, I cite the pro-choice thing; just an analogy to point out my dedication to my principles. Maybe I should have used The Passion and atheists... but it all comes out the same. B) As for the director, he is a Christian from what I have read, but that doesn't change the books content, and since the book is all I have read, that's all I can really speak to. Maybe I will see it now that I know this about the director - maybe he changed it enough that I won't be disgusted it all. But then I hate the changing of texts like that too... C) I haven't read or seen that much about the Golden Compass - if the author was writing in the same vein as Cooper, I doubt I will like it either. D) I think "religious debate" is the wrong phrase here - perhaps "religious reasoning" is better. I'm not looking to argue religion, but since it is the reasoning behind my dislike of the novels, I think it bears mentioning. Unless we want to be intolerent... Also maybe the humor of my emoticons got missed... I'd also like to point out that I do explicitly give this as my opinion, my view, whatever. So I don't plan to argue over this further - it's just my opinion, after all, based on books I read while I was in elementary school. Didn't realize it would cause such a ruckus...
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Post by grond on Nov 15, 2007 20:36:40 GMT -5
Wow! I'm really sorry the content and undertones of that series caused you to be unable to enjoy those books. I loved them, however the movie was lost on me. Half of what I expected was missing and a large part of the background to the story was so thoroughly changed that it left no room at all for certain details to even exist. Confused? You should be. I can't make sense out of what I just wrote. Anyway, you would not at all enjoy the Golden Compass, movie or book (Dmitri). I personally agree that it looks like the movie could really screw it up. There is a major movement of turning epic scope fantasy novels and series into movies, riding off of the success of LOTR, Harry Potter and what not, and like all of these movements tend to become, it is a "make a buck" kind of arrangement. No concern with, or seemingly even understanding of, quality. Of course, that is just my opinion. Also, I felt that the "Lion the Witch and the Wardrobe" was fairly well done, and didn't make any glaringly obvious, blunderingly stupid omissions or changes. Still, no high hopes for Golden Compass here.
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Post by pigdish on Dec 8, 2007 20:51:43 GMT -5
Saw this movie today and I was not disappointed. It was an awesome movie with beautiful special effects, great acting (especially the lead girl Lyra), great cinematography, and the story was engaging. I saw nothing in it that was anti-Christian or even general religious bashing. The bad guys in the movie could be any large organization, government, or syndicate wanting to control the world.
Overall I just loved this movie. It had a good feel to it and I absolutely loved the ice bears and the big fight they had. I also liked the concept of the daemons. I'm hoping it makes a ton of money so they can go ahead and make the other two movies, which I can't wait to see.
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Post by Antioch on Jan 7, 2008 8:21:37 GMT -5
Oh shoot, I didn't see there was a thread already for this. Didn't scroll down far enough apparently.
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